Show: Wrestling Epicenter
Guest: "The Patriot" Tom Brandi FKA Salvatore Sincere
Date: 06/27/2023
Your Host: James Walsh
Salvatore Sincere was a key part of the era between the New Generation of the WWE and the Attitude Era. Tom Brandi, a skilled veteran wrestler who had previously been Johnny Gunn in WCW and the AWF, played the role of the Mafia-like character with a lot of style. Hear how that character came to be as well as how he eventually dawned the red, white, and blue mask of The Patriot once worn by the late Del Wilkes. Tom Brandi, as The Patriot, will be working for Mid Atlantic Territory Wrestling on July 1st at their Scars & Stripes event and then the July 8th TV tapings. Be sure and check them out on Facebook! https://www.facebook.com/MATWrestling/
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TOM BRANDI:
On Mid Atlantic Traditional Wrestling's Scars & Stripes & TV Tapings:
"It is a great promotion started by mutual friends. I have done one show for them before and this will be my second and I have 2 more scheduled with them before the end of summer. The promoter, Brandon, called me. He's one of those guys you feel like you've known for years but we've just never directly met or worked in the ring or whatever via mutual friends. Well, he preached to me on how he wants to do things different than the rest of the independents. I've been doing this 37 years between the big leagues and the indy leagues. And, it was a breath of fresh air. Because, he was a man of his word. He wouldn't be doing it if he couldn't do it different. And, his idea is he wants to bring back the feel of 1992 WCW. The colors, the lighting, the mindset, the style of wrestling. What I've learned is what is old is new and old school never goes out of school. Plus, he mixes in all the new stuff too! So, you get a little bit of everything with his show!"
On if MITW Could Do Big Things:
"There's no doubt! He's got an A1 ring, a perfect ring for television. And, you live and you learn. You do your taping, you maybe see that you could do your lighting a little different and think, "Next time, I'm going to do this..." And, you know, I haven't been in Virginia a lot recently. You know, the COVID years! But, before that, Virginia was a real fun state to work. But, like everything else, it kind of quieted down. But, he (Brandon) has brought life back to the state!"
On the charm of ICW/IWCCW back in the day:
"You know, it was the alternative! If you were like me, you wanted as much wrestling as you could get. And, it gave you an alternative without the glitz and glamour of the WWE, WWF at the time, NWA, and the big leagues. It was a free agent type of thing. And, Maurio always got talent that had just been let go from one of those big companies. And, he would always get a big name star in his ring and he would package that and repackage that for years and years and years as he has a very deep library. But, for us, we were just coming up in the business. He would give us 2 and 3 days of wrestling work that we couldn't get anywhere else. He would bring us up to Maine which was kind of his territory - Vince wasn't running up there then so Mario would promote it for Vince. He knew the towns and the buildings. But, Mario (Savoldi) got us a lot of in ring experience we couldn't get anywhere else!"
On learning the ropes when he did:
"I was trained by a guy named King Kaluha. He was a mainstay in ICW/IWCCW. He was a local guy who I sought out and told that I wanted to be a wrestler. There were no wrestling scools back in those days. He trained me in back yards on grass, dirt, and mattresses. There were no schools... The only school that was close was the Monster Factory in New Jersey and that wasn't really close at all. So, our training was really on the job training. You learned in the ring and the only way to learn was experience. So, these kids today who are training for 3 months are way beyond where I was in 2 years!"
On being Johnny Gunn in WCW:
"That was my first big break! My first break was in Puerto Rico when I was working for a promotion that ran opposition to Carlos Colon (IWC) but I kept on at WCW and got my big break and made my debut at Halloween Havoc 1992 in Philadelphia. I loved my time there because you were in there with the absolute best of the best. You're on TV, you're doing house shows, and you're there with great guys!"
On the regime changes in WCW:
"I was hired by Bill Watts... Magnum TA called me on the phone. But, I was there maybe 4 or 5 months and then Bill Watts was gone. Then, it was Dusty. Ole had left so it was Dusty and Magnum but it was pretty much all Dusty. He was the one with the pencil and made all the decisions. But, WCW was great. I met a lot of great wrestlers and made friends for a lifetime."
On the short-lived AWF Promotion:
"AWF was probbaly my favorite promotion. The reaosn I say it was my favorite promotion was because they were the ones who really, really had plans for me above and beyond what anyone else had. But, it started to leak oil pretty fast. Paul Alpersteen was the promoter and he was funding it all himself and it didn't take long for it to start to leak oil. I mean, unless you were going to get a major television deal... He was able to get it on some small cable outlets. But, real small stuff and it just wasn't enough exposure. But, in a lot of ways, the AWF was my favorite promotion I ever worked for."
On teaming with WWE/WCW legend Jim Powers in AWF:
"Jimmy was a great guy. And, we all tried to help him. But, Jimmy had a real hard time adjusting to the indies. I don't know if he was just used to the WWF style but he just had such a hard time adjusting. I know he went on to WCW after that for a little while but there was a lot of money for Jimmy to make on the indy scene and he just didn't seem to want to do it."
On finally getting hired by WWE:
"I'll never forget it. I was about to live my dream. I got a phone call from a friend of mine who was reading Dave Meltzer's kayfabe sheet. He said, "Five of you guys are going to be hired tomorrow." I said, Read it to me!" He goes, "Tom Brandi, Alex Porteau, Bill Irwin, Tony Anthony, and Tracy Smothers have all been hired to above jobber status." And, I mean, it was like being kicked in the balls. I mean, I waited my whole life for this opportunity and here the opportunity finally came and it was like, why am I being labeled when I haven't even wrestled there yet? What they (WWE) were doing was they were getting ready to start a second house show loop and they needed veterans, they needed bodies, for people to work with. So, they hired us as we were all veteran guys."
On his persona of Salvatore Sincere in WWE:
"Sal Sincere was the only one they put any real effort in of those 5 guys. Everyone else got a real sorry ass outfit. I mean, everything is a rib in that company. Freddie Joe Floyd was the Brisco Brothers' middle names. One is Freddie Joe and the other is Floyd. They could have just let him be Tracy Smothers. The guy was already a legend! Alex Porteau they gave a sorry ass singlet. Tony Anthony, they gave a plunger... They ask you what you've done in life. And, for me, they saw me as a mobster, gangster type because of how I talk. I loved it! I loved the outfit. I loved the colors. And, everything you saw me do on TV I pretty much came up with myself unless they told me not to do it. But, they didn't give us any real direction."
On facing The Undertaker on WWE RAW:
"All of a sudden, I'm undefeated going into the main event of Monday Night RAW against The Undertaker!! I was like, they must think a lot of me to put me in this position to where I'm on a live RAW in the main event over 2 segments which was about 15 minutes against Undertaker... That was like an eternity! But, I was the only one of the 5 to get a new contract."
On the end of his WWE run:
"The biggest mistake was then turned me babyface and had me working against Marc Mero. I also had started to wrestle under my real name of Tom Brandi. It was all downhill from there. After a while, I put in my notice and I said that was it. I was not there to do jobs as myself."
On being a veteran at that point and only being in his early 30's:
"Well, it wasn't just about age but it was about being in the ring. Being a veteran back then was like I was wrestling for about 15 years. I had mentioned my first break was in Puerto Rico but my first break was really in Memphis. That was in 1988 and I wetn down there and wrestled for Jerry Lawler. I ent down there and was wrestling 6 days a week and finally got to where I felt I was pretty good thanks to the repetition. But, by the time I got to WWF, I had a lot of matches under my belt in those years to call myself a veteran. A lot of guys didn't."
On if he knew The Rock was going to become the star he became:
"Nobody knew about the box office because nobody cared back then or thought that could happen. But, as a wrestler, he was a can't miss thanks, in part, to his dad and his grandfather. We wrestled about 40 times and this was before the People's Elbow, the eyebrow, and all that other stuff he developed when they turned him heel. But, he was going to develop as a wrestler regardless. He was down to earth. But, he was going to develop because he had everything going for him! Everything!"
On how he became The Patriot:
"The story has never changed. In 1998, we were doing a series of wrestling shows at ARMY bases across the country for a guy named Tom Shade. You might remember the huge commercial campaign for 1-800-COLLECT? 1-800-COLLECT was humongous in the mid to late 1990's and they were sponsoring us. We were wrestling in front of 2,000 people a night and I was doing my Tom Brandi persona as a heel against Brian Lee. We had Honky Tonk Man, Greg Valentine, Jake Roberts, Sultan but it wasn't Rikishi, it was Umaga. Rikishi gave Umaga the gimmick because it was before WWE and he needed the ring time, he needed the experience. Well, they said we needed a red, white, and blue persona. They reached out to Del Wilkes. Del said he was completely retired. He had all kinds of injuries and ailments and he'd never wrestle another match again if he wanted to or not. So, Del Wilkes gave them the blessing to use the name and the character. So, that is how it started. Honky and Jake Roberts were looking for a guy to do the gimmick and they weren't finding what they were looking for. So, Honky said, "Just let Brandi wrestle twice He's got the body for it!" So, I got a mask and the tights and I became the ultimate good guy against the ultimate bad guy."
On Del Wilkes later having an issue with the namme being used:
"I was friendly with Del Wilkes in All Japan and in WWE. Never had any problems with him. And, for years and years, there was no problem with me doing the gimmick. But then came the podcasts nd people trying to stir the shit. But, Del Wilkes never said anything to me. He talked shit about it on podcasts. But, he never talked to me about it ever. To this day, my phone never rang and now he's gone so it never will. But, he never addressed me with an issue."
On Del telling us in a 2017 interview about his issue being with his picture being signed by Brandi:
"Yes, I did sign his picture and I'll tell you why. In 1998, they printed up pictures for us to sign for the military guys and because I had just started doing it, they had him on the picture. That was only on the first set of ARMY base shos. After that, I had my own pictures printed up. I didn't need his picture! So, it was only those first few shows that I ever did that and it was only because they needed me to sign something and I didn't have my own done up yet."
On Honky Tonk Man's concept for the Patriot:
"Honky was out to get Vince McMahon so he started to trademark a lot of the gimmicks that had expired so if WWE would put out a DVD or merchandise that included that gimmick, they would have to pay royalties. It was genius! The Patriot was one of those gimmicks. If Brutus Beefcake wanted to wrestle as Brutus Beefcake somewhere, Honky Tonk Man would make money. He told me, "You're going to be The Patriot. You're the only one who can do it. if Del Wilkes even wants to be the Patriot, he couldn't." Now, that was just him talking. Of course, if Del Wilkes wanted to do it somewhere, he wouldn't have been stopped. But, for 20 years, Del Wilkes didn't have a problem with it and wasn't doing appearances. You know, I've been doing this persona for 25 years now? Del Wilkes, his entire wrestling career from when he first wrestled as The Trooper to when he retired in 1998, was only 10 years."
On wrestlers skewing smaller these days:
"You know, wrestlers have gotten smaller but I'm glad these guys are getting their shot. In the old days, there were a lot of guys angry because they never got a shot because of their size. They had to make their bones in Japan. And, I don't know why the promotions never gave in. WCW gave in a little bit. Then WWE gave in a little bit. And now, well, I don't really look at it as their size because I'm not around there. But, all the guys on the show now can go. I mean, they're all great."